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More anti-Muslim elements to Ford Field prayer rally

9 November 2011 General 23 Comments Email This Post Email This Post

By Ed Brayton

More information is emerging about the people involved in organizing this weekend’s prayer rally at Ford Field amid accusations that the event is targeting local Muslims. People for the American Way reports that Lou Engle, the man behind the rally, worked with Transformation Michigan to put the event together.

Transformation Michigan is a conservative Christian group with a history of presenting the views of anti-Muslim extremists, including Rick Joyner, who is also involved with The Call Detroit rally, and Jerry Boykin. Both of them are part of the leadership team that organized the Detroit prayer rally.

Boykin is a former Lt. General who was forced to step down in 2003 after he told a church group, while wearing his uniform, that the U.S. was engaged in a Christian war against Islam. The Bush administration was particularly sensitive to sending a message to the Muslim world that America is at war with their religion rather than with those who commit terrorism in the name of that religion.

Boykin has argued that Islam “should not be protected under the First Amendment” and that they should not be allowed to build mosques anywhere in the United States.

Rick Warzywak of Transformation Michigan held a conference call in May of this year with Kim Clement, one of the “prophets” involved with the organization, who said that God had told him directly that this weekend’s event is going to convert millions of Muslims to Christianity all over the world. Clement will be speaking at the prayer rally.

Original post: More anti-Muslim elements to Ford Field prayer rally


  1. 3:54 And (the unbelievers) PLOTTED and planned, and Allah too planned, and the best of planners is Allah.

    16:45 Do then those who devise evil (PLOTS) feel secure that Allah will not cause the earth to swallow them up, or that the Wrath will not seize them from directions they little perceive?

  2. Being a Christian I have no problem with converting Muslims to Christanity just as Muslims have no problems converting Christians to Islam. Engle, however has an odd belief set. He wants to lead people in Prayers that last hours. As a Christian he should know better. In the Bible Matthew 8 Verse 7 states:
    “When ye pray use not vain repetitions as the heathen do for they think they shall be heard for their much speaking.”

    I have written, in the past, what I think of this guy and how he uses basic psychological needs to manipulate the people to whom he preaches. I would not hold this man up as a model Christian but more of a man who makes lots of money.

  3. @ criley401

    Are you truly a Christian??? I doubt your claim. If you were, you would not misuse the Holy Scriptures. There is a clear difference between repetitive prayers or set prayers that are repeated (which the Lord Jesus clearly deems to be pagan) and long prayers.

    King David pleaded with God for quite sometime at various stages of his life – there was a time when he pleaded for days and nights. Those are very long prayers. Also, read his Psalms. The Book of Psalm also speaks of Saints who “stand(minister) by night” in the House of the Lord. What do you think the Saints are doing? Twiddling their thumbs?

    And, in case you have missed this in the Bible, Jesus Christ prayed ALL NIGHT. LUKE 6:11-13 NKJ “12 Now it came to pass in those days that He (Jesus Christ) went out to the mountain to pray, and continued ALL NIGHT IN PRAYER…”. That is some very long prayer.

    I have learnt that often, people who are too lazy to pray or have no understanding of prayer, complain about those who actually pray for hours and seek God’s face continually.

    True Christians are clearly commanded to “pray without ceasing”.

  4. Keep hollering, crazy. Maybe God will hear you and cure your hatred & mental illness.

  5. @ Proverb

    Are you truly a Christian? If you were, you would observe Christ’s commandment to judge not, lest ye be judged.

    Oh wait, I have a better one, Proverb, Are you truly a Christian? If you were you would honor Christ’s commandment not to pray in public, calling attention to yourself, but to enter into your closet to pray.

    Oh here’s another: Proverb, are you truly a Christian? If you were, you would follow Christ’s commandment to love one another and to do unto others as you would have done to yourself.

    Proverb, none of us is perfect. All of us have different understandings. We can have disagreements but we cannot know each others’ hearts. Proverb, only you and God know your heart. Only Criley and God know Criley’s heart. We all use scripture to justify our actions and often we misuse it. None of us truly knows the heart and mind of God, but in faith and humility, we can approach God and let his love do its work in our hearts. When we take his role in judging others, we limit God and proclaim ourselves as higher than him.

    So I do not really dispute your commitment to Christ, but I encourage you to revisit the way you express disagreement and hope you will look to express that in less judgmental ways.

  6. Yeah well Proverb, I am not a saint and I am not Jesus. To pray without ceasing does not mean hours of prayer in which you repeat the same request. I admit a person could put together a very long list add some colorful words and possibly extend what they have to say. Point in fact, however, the average person will run out of things to say or ask for after a few minutes at that point the prayer repeats and becomes frivolous. Now if you think pray without ceasing means to pray for hours on end you are not very well grounded in your faith. This does not mean you’re not a Christian it just means that you need to put some thought, effort, and prayer behind your beliefs.
    Now you can disagree, and kneel and pray for an 8+ hour stretch if you want to but if you think that prayer made you a better Christian or by telling/confiding to someone what you do with the intent to show sacrifice, gain admiration, or display how much of a true Christian you are vs others who are not as “committed” then you need to rethink what you are doing. God cares about what is in people’s hearts as it defines their actions.

    With that said I stand by my comments on Lou Engles in this and the article I replied to a few days ago.

  7. @Jamesrfitz

    The Bible is clear that we should contend for the faith against falsehood. Criley has infact RIDICULED Christian prayer, calling those who pray long prayers “pagans”.

    That is not acceptable by Biblical standards. I am more than entitled to question the claim that he/she is a Christian, with that kind of remark.

  8. @ Criley

    I do question your claim that you are a Christian for the simple reason that no Christian would ridicule that which is Biblical. Jesus Christ prayed ALL NIGHT. Are you claiming that Jesus Christ was trying to ” gain admiration” or put on a display? That is precisely what your clear sarcastic comment shows.

    Like I said, I doubt that you are a Christian. No Christian would ridicule Christ’s example.

  9. ccc,

    that’s too funny, you pagan. see these are who you choose to identify yourself with.


    isn’t 3:54 dealing with jesus? haven’t read the 16th book yet but that quote 3:54 seems strange too me.


    فلما أحس عيسى منهم الكفر قال من أنصاري إلى الله قال الحواريون نحن أنصار الله آمنا بالله واشهد بأنا مسلمون

    But when Jesus felt [persistence in] disbelief from them, he said, “Who are my supporters for [the cause of] Allah ?” The disciples said,” We are supporters for Allah . We have believed in Allah and testify that we are Muslims [submitting to Him].


    ربنا آمنا بما أنزلت واتبعنا الرسول فاكتبنا مع الشاهدين

    Our Lord, we have believed in what You revealed and have followed the messenger Jesus, so register us among the witnesses [to truth].”

    yeah proverb,

    let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

  10. Ok Proverb have it your way. You read and see what you want to see, there is nothing I can do apparently to change your mind or even challenge you to look at another viewpoint. You must, however, be a very special man to be able to pray as Jesus prayed on the night before he was placed on trial. I do admit it is good to try to emulate Jesus and if that is what is in your heart then I am sure God understands. I will be sure to place you in my prayers and maybe you can be so kind as to place me in your prayer.

  11. Is Lou Engle Misrepresenting His Views On Muslims To Detroit Pastors?

  12. @ criley401

    In closing, I am not giving you my opinion. I am merely stating the Biblical Truth. A teachable spirit is key to our spiritual growth.

    Jesus Christ often spoke of persistence in prayer (He even used the parable of woman who continually approached the judge for justice as an illustration). The Apostle Paul spoke of persistence in prayer.

    Let me point out an obvious reality you have missed here: pagan repetitive prayers are often SHORT. I could provide you with a common example here of religions that use repetitive prayers (but this is not necessary). A repetitive prayer need not be long – it can last 15 minutes. But, it is still repetitive.

    Jesus Christ also did not pray all night before His crucifixion (but that’s another issue). But seeing that you brought up it up, it noteworthy that at Gethsemane, Jesus Christ did pray about ONE matter THREE TIMES – but He did not use vain repetitions. So, praying about a matter several times is not a problem here. Vain repetitions are the problem.

    Finally, there is a logical reason why a long prayer cannot simply be dismissed as unBiblical. Prayer, in Christianity, is HAVING A CONVERSATION WITH GOD. Once this principle is appreciated, then it becomes CLEAR why repetitive prayers are condemned and long prayers are not, in and of themselves, unBiblical. I can a have a LONG conversation with My Heavenly Father – there is no time limit to speaking with God… But I cannot logically claim to be talking to God if I am repeating rehearsed words whenever I claim to pray. The length of the conversation with God is not a problem.

    A Christian can talk ALL NIGHT with his/her Heavenly Father. Why would God object to this? He does not. But God CLEARLY objects to repetitive prayers – even if they are short – for they are clearly not conversation.

    Go in peace.

  13. @ m2… I do not believe in the koran. It is of no authority or benefit to me.

  14. proverb,

    me either. nor do i believe in the bible. both are poorly written, self contridicting. although they each are like a blind squirre.

  15. CAIR is still frothing at the mouth about the kuffar daring to hold a prayer vigil in a predominantly muslim area. They forget it’s America not the mid east. They forget about free speech. And while they are doing their best to present muslims as “victims” (yet again) of a non-existent threat they forget that Christians do not use the threats, tactics and bullying so esteemed by muslims. They’ve succeeded in creating another tempest in a teapot. lol.

  16. kinda like how islamaphobes froth at the mouth whenever muslims dare build a mosque anywhere in america.

  17. No, there’s a difference between a real threat and a perceived one. CAIR tends to panic over perceived ones.

  18. actually its islamphobes who panic over percieved threats, examples would be there tendancy to go apeshit over mosques that havent even been built yet because of the the hysteria that every single muslim in the world is a terrorist

  19. Ha! So you say. If anyone has the corner on hysteria, it’s muslims. Christians don’t murder their own in riots over cartoons. They don’t panic and trample their women and children on religious pilgrimages. They don’t whine and try to cast themselves in the victim role at every opportunity. They don’t project their bad deeds on their victims, in other words they don’t blame the victim. They don’t riot over cartoons that make fun of Christian beliefs. They don’t riot and intimidate when their flags or bibles are burned. They also don’t commit 4-5 terrorist attacks a day worldwide.

    I don’t consider using every legal approach available to stop the construction of a mosque in a residential neighborhood as “a “tendency to go apeshit”, I consider it common sense. You have one hell of a nerve considering there are NO churches in Saudi Arabia and the rest in the middle east are on their way out. In my opinion Americans are far too tolerant and that is deadly when dealing with people who are grossly intolerant.

    And I know of no one who believes that every muslim in the world is a terrorist, no more than I know of anyone who actually believe islam is “a religion of peace” lol.

  20. oh and as for nerve if anyone has “nerve” for lack of a better term its usually pam geller who champions herself as a fighter for human rights yet is willing to defend mass murders especially when they kill muslims….html

  21. You are entitled to your opinion or should I call it hatred of Pam Geller but you are hating her for the wrong reasons. I stand by Pam Geller, woman warrior in the fight to protect the freedoms and culture of Americans and the fight in the relentless jihad on non-muslims and there way of life..

  22. “there” should be “their”

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