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Amiens: two elderly Muslims attacked by far right thugs on way to mosque

7 May 2012 General 39 Comments Email This Post Email This Post
According to the complainants, perpetrators have claimed the extreme right. Google Maps

According to the complainants, perpetrators have claimed the extreme right. Google Maps

By France-Soir News / Service Miscellaneous Facts (with AFP)

En route to the mosque, the two old men were beaten by two men claiming the extreme right.

Two elderly people belonging to the Muslim community have been assaulted in the night from Friday to Saturday at Amiens. The two attackers claimed to be the extreme right, it was learned Sunday from the Regional Council of the Muslim faith of Picardy and the Somme prefecture.

The two victims, two men of 70 and 71, were attacked about five o’clock in the morning when they went to the mosque of Amiens-Nord to the prayer of Fajr, which must take place at dawn. After being manhandled by two men ”  with very short hair and claiming to be the extreme right  , “the two men were beaten.

Two complaints

Their lives are not endangered, but they were admitted to the hospital of Amiens including injuries to legs and ribs, according to the CRCM-Picardie.Their attackers, meanwhile, had fled.

Two complaints were filed Saturday afternoon at the police station of Amiens and an investigation was opened by the prosecutor of Amiens, the prefecture has confirmed, adding that the area where the assault took place was not equipped surveillance cameras.

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39 Comments »

  1. well that sucks. could have been worse though. the attackers could have been islamists. doubt they would have gotten off with just a trip to the hospital. just ask daniel pearl, or theo van gough or any of the 3000….nevermind, can’t ask them.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17980396

  2. Just remember that teacher in UK that was beaten nearly to death, and the assault committed on Miss Page.

    Courses in comparative massacres and assaults maybe should be given.

  3. don’t remember the miss page story. but i remember the somalis beating the crap out of that girl. and i remember one guys comment that her boyfriend was with her so it was alright.

    momo,

    looks like the cia is doing better at eliminating the bin laden want to be, then the moderates.

    doesn’t look good for that hostage. we’ll keep using our drones as long as they keep getting results.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17985709

    “It also comes one day after Fahd al-Quso, a senior al-Qaeda leader in Yemen, was killed by a US drone strike.”

  4. Moderator, can you please do an article on Sharia law?

  5. Very sad..

  6. Astagfirullah

  7. where is that?! nd y shud they beat them if theyr going to mosque?

  8. i bet they also beat their moms and pops in house! f**kin terrorists!

  9. It is probably going to get worse, as the Anti-Socialist backlash starts.

  10. If I was there there would have been three people beating there ass.

  11. If I was there there would have been three people beating there ass.

  12. @Ron Thompson – so beating elderly men is your thing, eh?? Wow, you must feel like a very macho guy. You probably kick puppies and slap women around too. You’d make Hitler proud.

  13. nonsense!! muslims r not terrorists

  14. Why were the thugs on their way to a mosque?

  15. Not only cowardly but despicable as well…..

  16. only God knows the truth of this video but im sure if they beated them ther must b sumthng wrong, im sure the reason isnt terrorism!!!
    stop poisoning people’s minds against islam nd muslims. thats awful

  17. How cowardly to beat up two elderly men in their seventies.

  18. This is a site about the sick state of racism in the world particularly against those of the Islamic faith. Why is it that some people have to get on here and spew their racist comments? Free speech? Hum! Somehow it seems like they happy these 2 elderly gentleman were accosted. What if these were their fathers or grandfathers? Stop the hate! That is what this site is for. STOP THE HATE!

  19. And just what, Raidah, inspired the Somali girls to attack the UK lady walking with her boyfriend? What inspired the thugs to beat up the teacher?

    The Somalis are on video. The thugs are on tape, talking about beating the teacher “for Allah and the deen”.

    Once I saw an interview with an Indonesian who said he had committed many sins. He thought he could expiate them and please Allah by killing unbelievers so he murdered some tourists.

    Yay! For Allah and the deen!

  20. Really pathetic.

  21. Too Bad 2 beat up elderly men

  22. :(

  23. Violence dose not justify violence…

    anon – what make you think that Somali girls attacked anybody because of some religious belief? Where does Islam become involved and being Somali does not make one a Muslim.

    Also – the Theo van Gogh murder was probably not an act of terrorism, but just the personal actions of a member of a street gang. The only one who called the murder of “theo” an “act of terrorism” is the Dutch State, the AIVD, and declaring the murder of “Theo” an “act of terrorism” has meant that the Dutch State can be on the “terrorism map.” Turning the murder of “Theo” into an “act of terrorism” has spawned a whole genre of books, articles, and a phony and utterly useless study field of nonexistent “jihad in the Netherlands.”

    Turning the murder of “Theo” into an “Act of terrorism” also had the effect of altering the Netherlands security and political relations with other nations, including the US, justified the domestic persecution of Dutch citizens of the Islamic faith, and the national tradition of tolerance, which is the Dutch people should be proud of.

    Another effect of turning the Theo van Gogh MURDER into an “act of terrorism” is to turn every violent act by individuals of a Muslim background into “jihadist terrorism” — when similar acts by non-Muslims are just horrible violent acts by ‘sick murders.’

    Now – I’ll bet nobody here can tell be what the most horrible, terrorist-type attack (it was 2009) in the Netherlands was … and it was not perpetrated by a “Muslim!”

    Any takers?!!!

  24. esp,

    “Violence dose not justify violence…” too bad muhammad didn’t go by that rule. so u are amish? a pacifist?

    “anon – what make you think that Somali girls attacked anybody because of some religious belief? Where does Islam become involved and being Somali does not make one a Muslim.” true being somali doesn’t make someone muslim. but they were. and they used it as a defence for there actions in court. and worse the judge took it into concideration in his ruling.

    “Also – the Theo van Gogh murder was probably not an act of terrorism, but just the personal actions of a member of a street gang.” i guess i have been given alot of disinformation, but my understanding of the case is that theo had made a movie where he projected verses of the koran on naked women. the screen play writen by the somali chick, no longer a muslim by the way and under protection. is that not the case? didn’t the murderer/terrorist put a note on his chest with a knife spewing something about blaspheming “the prophet”? murder and terrorism aren’t mutually exclusive.
    “The only one who called the murder of “theo” an “act of terrorism” is the Dutch State, the AIVD,” ah no i think everyone, present company excluded of course, would call that an act of terror. as in trying to manipulate others behavior through fear and terror.
    “and declaring the murder of “Theo” an “act of terrorism” has meant that the Dutch State can be on the “terrorism map.” Turning the murder of “Theo” into an “act of terrorism” has spawned a whole genre of books, articles, and a phony and utterly useless study field of nonexistent “jihad in the Netherlands.”” maybe so. but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t a terrorist act.

    “Turning the murder of “Theo” into an “Act of terrorism” also had the effect of altering the Netherlands security and political relations with other nations, including the US, justified the domestic persecution of Dutch citizens of the Islamic faith, and the national tradition of tolerance, which is the Dutch people should be proud of.” ok. the same could be said of 9/11. do you not consider that a terrorist act either. not sure why theo is in quotes? are you saying he never existed?

    “Another effect of turning the Theo van Gogh MURDER into an “act of terrorism” is to turn every violent act by individuals of a Muslim background into “jihadist terrorism” — when similar acts by non-Muslims are just horrible violent acts by ‘sick murders.’’ really? again murder is often a part of terrorism. so you are saying that ever time a muslim kills someone it is labeled as terrorism in the netherlands. can’t speak to that. i’m in florida and we don’t get alot of the dutch news. but here in the us i can think of at least two, now possible three high profile murders that haven’t been call terrorism. the guy in ny who cut off his wife’s head, the other ny or nj story where the guy had his buddy shot his wife 6 times. and now the southern claifornian iraqi chick. the last two both being labeled as hate crimes by this website. the last one unsolved at this point but it looks like a probably family affair. as most murders are.

    “Now – I’ll bet nobody here can tell be what the most horrible, terrorist-type attack (it was 2009) in the Netherlands was … and it was not perpetrated by a “Muslim!”

    Any takers?!!!” like i said i’m not prevy to dutch news much but i’ll flail about wildly as u seem to do. i remember a story on a motorcycle gang war. some grenades being thrown into a clubhouse. could have been in scandinavia though???????????
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_van_Gogh_(film_director)

    “The killer shot van Gogh eight times with an HS 2000 handgun, and Van Gogh died on the spot. The killer also tried to decapitate van Gogh with a knife,[4] and stabbed him in the chest with another. The two knives were left implanted; one attached a five-page note to his body. The note (Text) threatened Western countries, Jews and Ayaan Hirsi Ali (who went into hiding).[5][6] The note also referred to the ideologies of the Egyptian organization Takfir wal-Hijra.”

    funny you keep bringing this up??

  25. damn, my second guess.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_attack_on_the_Dutch_Royal_Family

    u euorpeans and ur kings and queens always make me laugh.

  26. put thanks for making me google.

    http://articles.cnn.com/2010-12-26/world/netherlands.arrests_1_dutch-arrest-dutch-police-dutch-authorities?_s=PM:WORLD

    not sure why we in the west keep taking in somalis. our liberal bleeding heart are going to get alot of people killed.

    u do crack me up so? how’s loonwatch doing? lol.

  27. god damn, that was in the 90s. my memerory isn’t what it used to be. to many drugs. lol.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Nordic_Biker_War
    “By the end of the war, 11 murders and 74 attempted murders had been committed and 96 people were wounded. Both clubs signed a treaty saying that no more chapters would be opened up in Scandinavia but both sides had already broken the treaty by the end of the 1990s.[citation needed] In Denmark, a law that banned motorcycle clubs from owning or renting property for their club activities was passed. The law has subsequently been repealed on constitutional grounds.

  28. Excuse me, Mike, but what does violence have to do with Islam? If Islam was so associated with violence – then why don’t we have a problem with all 1.5 billion Muslims?! Answer: WE DON’T, but we do have a problem with Islamophobes that demonize all Muslims for the actions of a few. We have people who kill in the name of Christian “pro-life…” and this violence has has nothing to do with Christianity. Islam has as much to do with violence as Christianity has to do with violence – because religious faith is personal.

    Theo van Gogh was murdered for the personal reasons and motives of Mohammed Bouyeri – and nobody else. The murder of “Theo” was not a statement of the Moroccan community, it was NOT and statement of Islam in the Netherlands – and the murder of “Theo” is the only claim of “jihad in the Netherlands” that can be made by the Dutch State and so-called “terrorism experts.”

    “The two knives were left implanted; one attached a five-page note to his body. The note (Text) threatened Western countries, Jews and Ayaan Hirsi Ali (who went into hiding).[5][6] The note also referred to the ideologies of the Egyptian organization Takfir wal-Hijra.”

    And who wrote this?! Mohammed Bouyeri alone wrote this and part of the motives of killing “Theo.” They are his ideas alone — and it has absolutely nothing to do with Islam in the Netherlands or the religious minority community living there. Only Mohammed Bouyeri alone is responsible for his own actions, we do not punish innocent people for the actions of others, but that’s what we now have in the Netherlands…and that includes the destruction of Dutch culture and traditions by the likes of Geert Wilders.

    I keep bringing this up because there are other disciplines, like criminology (that I have my undergraduate degree in) that can analysis the motives and reasons for Mohammed Bouyeri’s horrible actions. There is vastly more literature on Dutch minority ethnic street gangs and at-risk youth that describes Mohammed Bouyeri as a street gang member and Hofstadgroep as a street gang and NOT “an international terrorist network.” Again – only the Dutch State (AIVD) makes the “terrorist network” claim – and nobody else – other than to reflect the AIVD’s claim.

    I am planning a project this summer that will analysis “jihad in the Netehrlands” discourse by the Dutch State and the AIVD.

    The worst. most recent terrorist attack (but not called that) in the Netherlands occurred on April 30, 2009, Koninginnedag, in Apeldoorn, when Karst Tates (not a Muslim) rammed his black Honda into a crowd of parade watchers
    http://yellow-stars.com/blog/2010/04/29/queen%E2%80%99s-day-attack-at-apeldoorn-%E2%80%93-one-year-later/

    And – we can discuss the Alphen aan den Rijn shopping mall shooting on 9 April 2011, six people were killed by Tristan van der Vlis (again, not a Muslim) who entered the Ridderhof mall and fired off 100 rounds.

    We should notice a pattern here: It’s not “jihadist terrorism” if the killer is NOT a Muslim – and this means that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” depends upon the religious background of the killer. Mohammed Bouyeri is a “terrorist,” yet Karst Tates, who attempted to kill the royal family and killed more people, is not a “terrorist?!” The shooting at Alphen aan den Rijn is not a “Mumbai-style shooting” because Tristan van der Vlis is not a Muslim!

  29. Go ahead mike – and define “terrorism” for us…after all…the most vexing issue in the “terrorism studies field” is to arrive at a fixed definition for “terrorism.” The use of the term “political violence” or just violent criminal acts for personal reasons is much better.

    Given that defining the term “terrorism” is problematic, it is no wonder that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” falls to a default of “by Muslims.” We can know for sure that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” in the Netherlands is determined by the religious background of violent suspects.

    This is also discriminatory – and probably violates European and international human rights standards.

  30. The reason people say violence and Islam are connected is that there is a large set of clerics urging their congregations to acts of hatred and murder.

    Muslim governments implement genocidal policies against minorities, lynching with impunity is allowed, the broadcast of hatred and contempt for non muslims is loud and of long standing.

    Who you kidding besides yourself, eslaporte?

  31. You want us to ignore the rot being done in Islam’s name as you are ignoring it. We won’t do that.

  32. my bad i had your link in my paste. two links gets held by the monitor.

    eslaporte,

    “Excuse me, Mike,” no need to excuse you. you are welcome to your opinions.
    “but what does violence have to do with Islam?” well if you read the hadiths that say the best way to paradise is to fight in the cause of allah. to die fighting for allah. and you read how the 4 major schools of jurisprudence in islam says that anyone who blasphemes the prophet should die. then violence is clearly an offshoot of islam. don’t you think? if someone says you should kill someone because they insulted jesus, then wouldn’t christianity be partialy responsable if some christian kills that person? don’t people give partial responsability for the norwiegian terrorist to geller and her ilk?

    “If Islam was so associated with violence – then why don’t we have a problem with all 1.5 billion Muslims?! Answer: WE DON’T,” really? you don’t find 9/11 7/7 3/11 as problems? of course all 1.5 billion aren’t terrorist. i doubt even 1% are terrorist. but THERE ARE ISLAMIC TERRORIST. don’t know why everyone want’s to say there is no such thing????????????????????????????????? i’ve never said ALL muslims are terrorist.

    “but we do have a problem with Islamophobes that demonize all Muslims for the actions of a few.” i agree it is a problem when you demonize all people in a group for the actions of a few. i see it here every day. go check out the article on the afghan woman suing the republican party. you will see a bunch of people demonizing republicans. there’s my deflection for ya. plus i’m a republican.

    “We have people who kill in the name of Christian “pro-life…” and this violence has has nothing to do with Christianity. Islam has as much to do with violence as Christianity has to do with violence – because religious faith is personal.” ok, but i think all the abrahamic religions are violent in nature, just read the bible and the koran and the hadiths.

    “Theo van Gogh was murdered for the personal reasons and motives of Mohammed Bouyeri – and nobody else.” he was murdered for blasphamy, was he not. did not the muslim believe he was acting in accordance with islam?
    “The murder of “Theo” was not a statement of the Moroccan community, it was NOT and statement of Islam in the Netherlands – and the murder of “Theo” is the only claim of “jihad in the Netherlands” that can be made by the Dutch State and so-called “terrorism experts.”” clearly this muslim thought he was act in the name of islam. so what were the “personal reasons”. he owed him money. theo had an affair with his wife. did the killer even know him on personal basis? are you married to a moroccan? you seem blinded by your zeal.

    ““The two knives were left implanted; one attached a five-page note to his body. The note (Text) threatened Western countries, Jews and Ayaan Hirsi Ali (who went into hiding).[5][6] The note also referred to the ideologies of the Egyptian organization Takfir wal-Hijra.””

    ‘And who wrote this?! Mohammed Bouyeri alone wrote this and part of the motives of killing “Theo.” They are his ideas alone — and it has absolutely nothing to do with Islam in the Netherlands or the religious minority community living there. Only Mohammed Bouyeri alone is responsible for his own actions, we do not punish innocent people for the actions of others,” i agree we shouldn’t. but it is clear what his inspiration was. i’m not saying round up all the muslim. but if muslims are’t willing to look at their religion and weed out the bad parts i will continue to critisize them. they continue to say sharia is a good thinG. IT IS NOT. IT IS VIOLENT AND DRACONIAN.

    “but that’s what we now have in the Netherlands…and that includes the destruction of Dutch culture and traditions by the likes of Geert Wilders.” too bad

    “I keep bringing this up because there are other disciplines, like criminology (that I have my undergraduate degree in) that can analysis the motives and reasons for Mohammed Bouyeri’s horrible actions. There is vastly more literature on Dutch minority ethnic street gangs and at-risk youth that describes Mohammed Bouyeri as a street gang member and Hofstadgroep as a street gang and NOT “an international terrorist network.” Again – only the Dutch State (AIVD) makes the “terrorist network” claim – and nobody else – other than to reflect the AIVD’s claim.” ok so he was a street gang criminal. i have no degree in criminology, so please bear with me. so why kill a film maker on his bike? was theo in a turf war with his gang? did he rob him? why put the note on his chest? perhaps the killer felt he could have his former sins fogiven by waging jihad, again read some hadiths. i don’t know, i don’t claim to know. but it appears that islam motivated him to kill theo, and his note means to warn others not to act in what he considers an unislamic way. therefore i will define him as an islamic terrorist.

    “I am planning a project this summer that will analysis “jihad in the Netehrlands” discourse by the Dutch State and the AIVD.” go for it

    “The worst. most recent terrorist attack (but not called that) in the Netherlands occurred on April 30, 2009, Koninginnedag, in Apeldoorn, when Karst Tates (not a Muslim) rammed his black Honda into a crowd of parade watchers” yeah i posted a link to that. it did accualy accur to me that….nevermind it doesn’t matter.

    “And – we can discuss the Alphen aan den Rijn shopping mall shooting on 9 April 2011, six people were killed by Tristan van der Vlis (again, not a Muslim) who entered the Ridderhof mall and fired off 100 rounds.” wasn’t aware, i’ll google it.

    “We should notice a pattern here: It’s not “jihadist terrorism” if the killer is NOT a Muslim – and this means that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” depends upon the religious background of the killer. Mohammed Bouyeri is a “terrorist,” yet Karst Tates, who attempted to kill the royal family and killed more people, is not a “terrorist?!” The shooting at Alphen aan den Rijn is not a “Mumbai-style shooting” because Tristan van der Vlis is not a Muslim!” agian i’ve never said all terrorist are muslims. most aren’t, at least in the west. but u do read the daily news?

    “Go ahead mike – and define “terrorism” for us…after all…the most vexing issue in the “terrorism studies field” is to arrive at a fixed definition for “terrorism.” The use of the term “political violence” or just violent criminal acts for personal reasons is much better.” yes i’m aware the un hasn’t been able to define terrorism. but this is the same body that agrueed for 6 months as to weather the word “the” should be put in a resolution. but i’ll take my shot. TERRORISM – a violent act for a political or ideological reason. meant to presude a populace to a paricular stance or policy. a violent act meant to instill fear in people and to presuade them to a particular action or lack there of. how’s that short and concise. lol

    “Given that defining the term “terrorism” is problematic,” u sound like the supreme court judge in the 70s who couldn’t define pornography. but what did he say? i know it when i see it?

    “it is no wonder that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” falls to a default of “by Muslims.” We can know for sure that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” in the Netherlands is determined by the religious background of violent suspects.” jesus fucken christ are you serious? i don’t know what they do in holland, but everyone from the shining path to the ira to the weather underground to timothy mcveigh to the jdl are labeled terrorist in the us…. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_terrorism_in_the_United_States

    “This is also discriminatory – and probably violates European and international human rights standards.” ok, take it to the hague.

    //mike
    11 May 2012 at 7:02 pm

  33. The Irish thing wasn’t called catholic terrorism because priests at Mass did not scream for the blood of the Protestants.

    Mobs go running out of mosques to kill and beat up “the other” – so what it isn’t your mosque. The name of Islam is blackened by all this just as the Inquisition blackened the name of the RC Church.

    In my view the verse “strike evil with your hand when you see it” can be read as a carte blanche by any self righteous lout who wants to beat someone up.

  34. For my parting shot on this board:

    Actually – there is NO set definition for “terrorism” and the definition varies from local to national to international. Some acts that can be described as “terrorism” occur in the course of revolutions and military conflicts. It has to do with discourse over “terrorism” and how “terrorism” is defined. We also have real world practices, or operationalization.

    We then have the operationalization of what “terrorism” means to national governments in the practice of law enforcement and judiciary. We DO see the anti-Muslim bias in what is labeled as “terrorism” and what is not “terrorism” – and yes- the religious background of the suspect DOES play a role and -yes- this is discriminatory, especially if there are higher sentences and greater punishments for “terrorism.” We DO see this in the Netherlands…

    The actions of Tristan van der Vlis and Karst Tates have not been labeled “terrorism” – and they could have been.

    When a mass killer of Muslim background went on a shooting rampage in France recently- this was “lone wolf jihad” and a “European security threat,” but the same level of concern was not given to the aftermath of the shootings of immigrant vendors in Italy, the discovery of the Doner killers in Germany. We don’t even see the same level of concern (especially out of Europol) for “lone wolf” killers of the far right in the aftermath of the terrorist attacks in Norway as we do in the aftermath of the killing in France!

    The field of criminology and critical terrorism studies can say other things about Mohammed Bouyeri. Mohammed Bouyeri does have a history of violence well before the killing of “Theo” and in street gangs. I do know of literature and studies of Dutch street gangs that could define Mohammed Bouyeri as a low level street gang member looking to elevate his status in the Hofstad street gang through a high profile murder. This is a viable explanation. Therefore I label Mohammed Bouyeri a low level street gang — and this is actually a better label for him.

    When an individual kills another – the explanations for the killing are never pinned on whole communities or other people living in these communities. The killing of “Theo” and the motivations for his killing are only the responsibility of Mohammed Bouyeri. Bouyeri’s motivations are his own — and not a “statement” of the Moroccan community, Moroccan youth or Dutch citizens that practice. In the Western world, we prosecute and punish individuals for their own criminal acts – not whole communities of groups of people.

    Perhaps there should be NO designation of “terrorism,” but that all violent crimes, no matter the motivations of the suspects, should be treated the same, without religious or ethnic descriptions.

    Thanks Mike for trying to remain civil and reasonable…but “jesus fucking christ” is totally uncalled for!

    Bye – bye…

  35. “For my parting shot on this board:” oh comeon now? u can’t hang. this is fun, don’t you think?

    “Actually – there is NO set definition for “terrorism” and the definition varies from local to national to international. Some acts that can be described as “terrorism” occur in the course of revolutions and military conflicts. It has to do with discourse over “terrorism” and how “terrorism” is defined. We also have real world practices, or operationalization.” ok. didn’t you raed where i said i’m aware that the UN, the governing body of international law has been unable to define terrorism??????

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism

    wiki quote from above link. “In the international community, however, terrorism has no universally agreed, legally binding, criminal law definition.”

  36. “We then have the operationalization of what “terrorism” means to national governments in the practice of law enforcement and judiciary. We DO see the anti-Muslim bias in what is labeled as “terrorism” and what is not “terrorism” – and yes- the religious background of the suspect DOES play a role and -yes- this is discriminatory, especially if there are higher sentences and greater punishments for “terrorism.” We DO see this in the Netherlands…” ok. i agree. we also have natioanl, local, laws dealing with “hate crimes”. where often the race, religion, sexual preferance, etc of a person are taken into account. i have no problem with eliminating these laws. but to say:
    “it is no wonder that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” falls to a default of “by Muslims.” We can know for sure that what is “terrorism” and who is a “terrorist” in the Netherlands is determined by the religious background of violent suspects.” is clearly wrong. in the US as my link proves more non-muslim groups are labeled as terrorist then muslim organization? did you not read that? of course i’m not privy to all those labeled as terrorist in the netherland, but i would have to imagine some non-muslims have been called terrorist?

    “The actions of Tristan van der Vlis and Karst Tates have not been labeled “terrorism” – and they could have been.” never heard of these people? let’s google.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alphen_aan_den_Rijn_shopping_mall_shooting
    “He had a history of psychological and psychiatric problems, including paranoid schizophrenia; in 2006 he spent 10 days in a closed institution after attempting suicide.[19] He tried to commit suicide at least twice in 2008.

  37. Karst Tates

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_attack_on_the_Dutch_Royal_Family

    “Tates’ motive remains unclear. He had called his mother to congratulate her on her birthday on the day before the attack and said he was looking forward to her birthday party on 3 May. He left no indication he was planning anything.” ok you have one paranoid schizophrenia and anoter guy who no one know as to why. your comparisons are silly. perhaps the note and the “marty” videos of muslims is one of the problems.

  38. “Perhaps there should be NO designation of “terrorism,” but that all violent crimes, no matter the motivations of the suspects, should be treated the same, without religious or ethnic descriptions.” sounds good to me. i’ve never understood why attempted murder carries a lesser penalty. just because you fail at killing someone shouldn’t lessen your penalty. i agree you are no less dead if you are killed for political, financial, religious reasons, or just because your husband wants to be with another woman and doesn’t want to lose half his shit in a divorce.

    “Thanks Mike for trying to remain civil and reasonable…but “jesus fucking christ” is totally uncalled for!” oh well, i can lose my patientce sometimes. oh shit i just used the word shit earlier.

    “Bye – bye…” come on now don’t be a baby.

    “not whole communities of groups of people.”
    you do know that after the okc bombing the fbi infiltrated right-wing organizations throught the US. and that was a good thing.

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